New FASST compatible receivers from China

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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby TomBates » Thu Aug 12, 2010 2:03 pm

I realize that not all Futaba RX's will not work with the 6EX 2.4 radio so I'm wondering if the new TFR-8 will work with it? Maybe, I hope.

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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby etheli » Thu Aug 12, 2010 7:50 pm

cuban8 wrote:Interesting review on the Chinese Foobar FAAST Rx. But why do you keep rubbishing Spektrum's performance? ...

When Bruce was on the All Things That Fly podcast (#150), he framed it in terms of increasing levels of reliability. The old 35/72MHz FM systems use a single frequency and are the least reliable. The older 2.4GHz systems (like Spektrum DSM2) use two frequencies and are a definite improvement from FM. However, the frequency-hopping FHSS systems (like Futaba FASST) are significantly more reliable than DSM2 because they make use of so many more frequencies. So, it's not that DSM2 is bad or unusable, it's just that an FHSS system is a step above in terms of reliability.

Another thing is the brownout voltage, and after Spektrum posted their deceptive-propaganda video about it, they deserve to trashed on the issue.

--ET
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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby RCModelReviews » Thu Aug 12, 2010 9:28 pm

My comments were indeed a jibe at Spektrum, but not without reason.

Spektrum has the worst low-voltage performance of any system I've tested -- full stop. So long as Spektrum users make sure their batteries or BECs are 100% up to the job then this isn't a problem. Unfortunately, far too many people either use the wrong batteries (such as the 4-cell NiMH that Spektrum have provided - duh!) or believe the claims of many Chinese-made ESCs that their BECs are up to the job (which they're often not).

Throw a 2S A123 pack with a heavy-duty switch harness on a Spektrum receiver and you will never have a power problem.

But it's still the poorest-performing 2.4GHz receiver in respect to brownout and RF resilience. Those are just the facts.
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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby cuban8 » Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:11 am

With the greatest respect, I think you damn Spektrum with faint praise. OK, your results show Spektrum to have a worse brownout performance than Futaba, that I don't dispute. However, it doesn't make the system unuseable, providing good practice and a sensible expectation from an installation is maintained. After all, who in their right mind is going to knowingly run a system at less than 3V anyway.I understand and accept that a heavily loaded power supply may collapse under load if inappropriatly specified, and as you quite rightly say the Futaba threshold is better when a system is struggling at the extremes of performance. Will this lead Futaba FASST users into a false sense of security and take their focus off ensuring their systems are up to scratch? Even Futaba FASST will go for that "cup of Cocoa" :D if users don't specify their power source correctly and rely on the now well publicised better threshold.
I agree with you 100%, facts are facts, and we all thank you for taking the time, trouble and expense to bring this info to us.

Cheers.

C8
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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby RCModelReviews » Fri Aug 13, 2010 9:04 am

It's all about headroom.

What happens if one of the batteries in your receiver pack shorts out?

With Spektrum you're probably looking at watching your model take a big dirt-nap. With almost every other system you'll probably get it down in one piece because the remaining voltage will still be higher than the brownout level.

Even the best maintained setups can have failures (servos that short out and place a huge load on the receiver battery, causing it to droop; cells that short out; a linkage that binds or jams causing the servo to draw lots of amps; etc). The advantage of having the extra headroom that other systems provide is that it significantly improves your chances of surviving such an unforeseen incident.

This is perhaps why there are so many more "unexplained loss of control" incidents with Spektrum than with other systems -- the other systems have more headroom to come and go on when/if something bad happens.

What surprises me is that Spektrum are still charging "state of the art" prices for gear that is now really showing its age. How long will people keep paying those prices?

I don't know... but I am still getting increasing numbers of emails from DSM2 fliers who have spent too much money digging wrecks out of the ground (or almost doing so) and want something a little safer.

So far I haven't had any emails from Futaba or Hitec users wanting to switch. You have to ask why that is, don't you?
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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby abbydawn » Fri Aug 13, 2010 7:24 pm

"My comments were indeed a jibe at Spektrum, but not without reason."

Sometimes the truth hurts, and in this case Spek users. When making comparisons what is one to do? Hide the facts? The bench mark has always been and still is Futaba IMO.
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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby Modelman » Sun Aug 15, 2010 1:29 am

I seem to recall a poll conducted on a very well known website on what 2.4Ghz Radio people were using. Spektrum won hands down with about 65%-70% of users and all other makes made up the remainder. I use it and it works as well as any 35Mhz / 2.4Ghz equipment I've ever tested especially with electric flight.
Your reports of problems with Spektrum equipment will always be more than any other make purely because that's what the majority of people are using. Now the market is being flooded with copied DSM2 RX's at stupid prices I'm sure Spektrum users will not readily be switching to other makes.
The new DX8 is also more sensibly priced. Perhaps an unbiased review of this radio is needed...
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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby Rob2160 » Sun Aug 15, 2010 4:25 am

Having just jumped back into this hobby about 3 months ago.. (Started in the 70s, flew right through to 2000 - then a 10 year 'distraction with model trains")

So my first purchase was a Star Max Ducted Fan F-18 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ib3GRSHt-E8 and a Spektrum DX6i.. (thought the Bind and Fly options sounded good for the future)

I bought it but had to go away with work for a week.. during that time away, reading forums like this and many others, I lost confidence in the Spektrum gear and didn't want to entrust my Brand New (and First) ducted fan jet to such a "problematic" radio.

So I bought a Futaba 6EX 2.4ghz and installed that in the jet.

It has been flawless and completely reliable - so much so that I bought a second one for a another EDF (Art-tech Eurofighter) - and again that has worked flawlessly (a 2nd FASST RX was going to cost $139 - a Full system with TX/RX was $227... so what would you do??)

Anyway, I digress, Since then, I have used the Spektrum DX6i in over 300 flights on a Blade MSR, and over 600 further flights on Parkzone aircraft, (SU-26 Micro, Corsair, Brushless Mustang, Radian Glider flown to tiny speck distances, and an Art-tech Spitfire with an AR500rx)

I have to say that while initially hesitant about the Spektrum Gear it also gets my FULL Vote of confidence - I have not had a single issue.. I even tested it in the air by deliiberatly running a li po to exhaustion and there was NO brown out for me (destroyed the li po.. but that was intentional)

I Now always use an electronic timer and land with at least 20% remining in the aircraft batteries, but from my experience the Spektrum Gear has proven itself.
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Re: New FASST compatible receivers from China

Postby RCModelReviews » Sun Aug 15, 2010 6:37 am

Modelman wrote:I seem to recall a poll conducted on a very well known website on what 2.4Ghz Radio people were using. Spektrum won hands down with about 65%-70% of users and all other makes made up the remainder. I use it and it works as well as any 35Mhz / 2.4Ghz equipment I've ever tested especially with electric flight.

Yet surprisingly, the number of unexplained loss of control failures with Spektrum/DSM2 makes up significantly more than 65%-70% of the total reported incidents

Your reports of problems with Spektrum equipment will always be more than any other make purely because that's what the majority of people are using.

Yet, as I've said before, I'm getting a regular stream of emails from Spektrum/DSM2 users who have decided to change to another system because of the issues they've had with "unexplained loss of control". I get no similar emails from the users of other systems. That further points to the fact that DSM2 maybe showing its age and no longer suitable for all environments.

Now the market is being flooded with copied DSM2 RX's at stupid prices I'm sure Spektrum users will not readily be switching to other makes. The new DX8 is also more sensibly priced. Perhaps an unbiased review of this radio is needed...

Yes, as soon as I can get my hands on one I'll put it through the testing process. I won't be reviewing the DSM2 aspect, since I've already done that. What interests me most is how they've improved the programming, the ergonomics and how well the telemetry works. Those are the things that people will want to know and, from what they've shown us so far, all looks good.
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