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Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 12:34 pm
by cynr100
Thought I had better start this under a new topic.
My AXN should be ready to fly again in a day or 2.
Because of my limited space (and ability) I want to learn to fly slow, obviously above stall, most aircraft utilise flaps to maintain lift in low speed situations.
If I were to adjust the aileron rods on my AXN to give a 5-10deg down position on both ailerons at neutral would this provide some lift assistance to the wing with low airspeed and would I have a reasonable amount of aileron control.
It's just an idea but would like some feedback before I throw this puppy into the dirt again :D

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 5:06 pm
by kaptain_zero
I can't remember the radio you are using, but a 9x with er9x firmware would allow you to program that in, selectable with a switch... I would think most of the more advanced radios could do that. As for if it would work or not.... I'd get 3 mistakes high and flip the switch and see what happens.....


Regards

Christian

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Thu Apr 05, 2012 7:58 pm
by RCModelReviews
Everyone who has tried using the ailerons as flaps has gone back to the stock setup.

The AXN will fly very slow - you just have to learn to fly it that way.

Hint: throttle is a key control for slow flying. I probably spend as much time jockeying the throttle stick as I do moving the elevators when flying slow. Also, as the model gets slower, the rudder becomes more important when turning and especially when leveling out from turns.

Lots of folk might as well put their throttle on a switch and think the rudder is just for decoration. Learn to use these two controls as well as you use elevator/aileron and you'll find flying to be much easier.

The best way to learn to use your rudder and throttle is to get a heli - or at least practice flying a heli on the sim.

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:11 am
by cynr100
I'm using a RadioLink T6EHP-E which came with my 450 heli, still waiting on my FlySky to show.
The T6E was put together for helis and has no mixing for fixed wing, I had to experiment to get 4chs operating mode1. I don't want to make changes to this unit as I may rebuild the heli.
I was getting good ground practice with my heli (was upto 15 battery cycles :) ) got over having issues with the gyro so replaced it and in the process destroyed the 450 in a hangar accident (sans rotors luckily but there was still blood).

Thanks for the advice, will ditch the aileron experiment, grow some balls and get myself some height.

One thing I have noticed and will change is my orientation to my flying space. I kept moving around the perimeter so I constantly had to realign my danger zone, I'm better off marking one spot and staying there :o . After watching hours and hours of SWMAC guys something has finally clicked, they all orientate to the same field position.

I shall persist and I will prevail with large thanks to this forum.

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 6:26 am
by Hallmark
As another true beginner I would like to offer my support and advice - and since you're not married to me you'll probably want to hear some of it :lol:

In my opinion (as unqualified as that may be), flaps would only make this thing too slow and require more power to stay up and active. As Bruce says these things fly with very little effort from us and we need only to take charge and insist on a good performance! With that in mind let's move on...

You need lots and lots of clear open and unencumbered space, both in the air and on the ground. Flying in the electric tower, brick building sh*t pit you were was fraught with danger despite being rather amusing :D I sort of compare my flying space to that of an airport - not too many trees and buildings within close proximity - two soccer fields or cricket grounds is a good space to gain confidence (because confidence is the key here the rest comes quiet easily after). It is preferrable that there are no sporting activities at the time, but they tend to leave fast when they see you're completely out of control...

I think I mentioned this before, but height is your friend ;) . Get the AXN up above twice the height of the trees and you will quickly find this bird becomes much easier to handle. Not only that, but there is then more room for error and therefore recovery if error happens to find you. If the wind bumps it or it hits some turbulence, just relax the sticks for a second and react to the plane not try to force it out of it's path hastily. Mate I have ploughed my AXN from 100 feet at full throttle (I don't know why I keep hitting throttle when nose diving, but I do :oops: ), it breaks, but is repairable there and then. I actually am not afraid of crashing any more, more afraid of rescuing it from tall trees now :oops: If you're afraid of the crash the crash will seek you out often Padawan. Let the force guide you - you can control this machine you just need to believe. 8-)

Of all the advice I got this was the best: Don't chase the plane with your controls, rather control the plane with small and purposeful inputs. Watching where the plane goes when you input a control - say left bank - gives you the perspective of your action. I hope I don't sound condescending, but this has helped me to no end. When the plane turns use a little up elevator to keep the nose pointing up. Rudder turns are slow, but work very well. While you get used to the height let the rudder be your directional device and use ailerons only if needed and then in small inputs. Now I have mixed expo and D/R into mine so I don't have full throw on turns unless I choose to.

Throttle should be no less than 1/3 - 1/2 until confidence is reached (this comes about 20 mins after you watch the first "I didn't crash" video lmao...) Going too fast is a pain in the butt and going too slow is a pain in the nose cone, so find that 30% - 50% place and play nicely there.

Did I notice you don't have a neck strap? Personally I found this addition to my kit invaluable because I no longer needed the extra background operation of holding the Tx, which allowed me to concentrate all my efforts on the sticks, the environment and orientation. This may sound silly, but one less issue to deal with makes the other matters seem less difficult too. I made my first one from a work ID holder...

Well that is enough dribble from me, but I believe in your ability to fly this puppy and I expect to see a video post soon with exactly that depiction and a happy camper dancing over to pick up the purposefully landed AXN at the end!

Your mate,

Hallmark

PS: Landings are best without any throttle, a smooth glide and don't be picky about a specific place (like Bruce lands at his feet :P ), just landing under control is worth the 100 metre walk :roll:

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:25 am
by cynr100
Jesus mate :o its either raining or you've broken your AXN, Tolstoy took years to write his book you did it in an afternoon :lol: :lol:

All good advice and much appreciated :D , thought I had found a new field today, 2 soccer fields wide and long. It has a 6 line highway at one end :( best I not play there.

The missus has hurt her back so I'm stuck with chores but should be able to get flying Monday. Apparently it's clean the fans day Sunday, I offered to move the ladder around for her now I stuck with the whole shebang :roll:

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:34 am
by Hallmark
Sounds fine - just don't play at the cars end lol...

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:51 am
by Hallmark
cynr100 wrote:The missus has hurt her back so I'm stuck with chores but should be able to get flying Monday. Apparently it's clean the fans day Sunday, I offered to move the ladder around for her now I stuck with the whole shebang


We had an old adage in the green machine: Keep your eyes and ears open, mouth shut and volunteer for nothing...! I'll say no more :roll:

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Sat Apr 07, 2012 10:55 pm
by quarry44
What you suggest may sound good in theory,but in practice,adding flaps adds more complication,something you don't want at this stage of the game.It also involves co-ordinated use of throttle and elevators,again not really within the grasp of a beginner.
Bruce has given you the best option for your situation,and practice,practice,practice.You'll get there,mate,just keep at it.

Re: Aerodynamic Control

PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2012 2:05 pm
by rogueqd
You mentioned limited space, that makes things harder. To compensate for that you're adding flaps, which makes things harder.

Many people, myself included, think (or thought in my case) the solution to being a beginner is adding more equipment. Don't. Just keep things simple. A big open space is simpler than a small space with obstacles.

Go for a drive and find a nice big field. Fly in that for a few times until you can fly in a small part of the field close to yourself, then try again in your limited space. After that think about adding flaps.

Lastly, the AXN comes with a Y cable for ailerons, so if you want to mix flaps in you need to put the ailerons on 2 separate channels first. More complexity.