Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby Sid Sideslip » Sat Aug 06, 2011 11:48 pm

Thanks Shotglass, +1 internet to you.

I guess this Turnigy ESC would be the one: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__3730__TURNIGY_Sentry_60amp_Speed_Controller.html

I'll order some along with the motor, props/hubs and servos for the flaps (and some more for spares).

Looking forward to flying the Phoenix. :D
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby Shotglass » Sun Aug 07, 2011 9:20 pm

yeah it is but its way too expensive for what it does really
only reason its in the plane i cause we had them lying around

like i mentioned any 50-60 amp esc with brake will do any hobbyking currently has some in the 15$ range
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby Sid Sideslip » Mon Aug 08, 2011 5:42 am

Shotglass wrote:yeah it is but its way too expensive for what it does really
only reason its in the plane i cause we had them lying around

like i mentioned any 50-60 amp esc with brake will do any hobbyking currently has some in the 15$ range


By "brake" do you mean the ability to set up the ESC to stop and lock the prop so it won't windmill for a powered glider? Not sure what you mean there. So many new terms to learn! :|

Edit: I Googled "ESC brake" and found out my guess was correct.

Also, I have read that a lot of peeps use a separate BEC from the ESC, because if the ESC fries you usually lose your BEC as well and so the Rx will stop working. Any thoughts on that people?

Btw, the Phoenix arrived today in good condition. Have yet to try the servos and motor etc. But I'll still buy a better motor and ESC even if it works OK out of the box. For a cheap glider it looks quite good btw...well, except for the control hinges and the clevises. Easy to fix those though.
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby Shotglass » Tue Aug 09, 2011 12:24 am

Sid Sideslip wrote:By "brake" do you mean the ability to set up the ESC to stop and lock the prop so it won't windmill for a powered glider?


exactly youll wan the esc to stop the prop so it can fold away

Also, I have read that a lot of peeps use a separate BEC from the ESC, because if the ESC fries you usually lose your BEC as well and so the Rx will stop working. Any thoughts on that people?


nothing fundamentally wrong with that although i dont really see the point in a model that cheap

But I'll still buy a better motor and ESC even if it works OK out of the box.


whatever power setup you go for keep in mind that the thing is meant to be flown as a glider
so use the motor to get it up and then switch it off and try to find some updrafts
the motor will most likely get plenty hot even when operated only in short bursts

also another thing i rememberd... the front of the fuselage is rather thin and soft and flexible
it needs some reinforcing if youre going to put 600W through it
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby Sid Sideslip » Tue Aug 09, 2011 1:38 am

Shotglass wrote:
But I'll still buy a better motor and ESC even if it works OK out of the box.


whatever power setup you go for keep in mind that the thing is meant to be flown as a glider
so use the motor to get it up and then switch it off and try to find some updrafts
the motor will most likely get plenty hot even when operated only in short bursts

also another thing i rememberd... the front of the fuselage is rather thin and soft and flexible
it needs some reinforcing if youre going to put 600W through it


Thanks for that.

I took the trouble to read through the Phoenix thread on RC Groups last night and most guys have had issues with the fuse overheating and softening the plastic at the front especially if they are heavy with the throttle. I'll pop in a 3/16" ply ply plate and glass up the area to stiffen it and provide some insulation. Maybe cut some cooling holes with an exhaust at the rear of the canopy. Want to keep drag down though, so it's a delicate balance. Also use a smaller prop of around 9*5 or 6 to reduce the current draw (and heat) and maybe set the throttle to 80% or so on the Tx.

I intend to use it mostly for slope soaring, rather than a midliner or whatever. Will also chase some thermals if it ever warms up. Plenty of wind here, though not many good sites free of trees or rocks, so I'll also tape the leading edges to provide a bit of protection there and put some dark covering or water-based paint under the wings for better visibility. Apparently they soar quite well with a bit of camber mix and turn better with aileron differential.

All good fun fooling around. :D
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby disco stu » Tue Aug 09, 2011 4:46 am

My phoenix arrived yesterday. I've already ordered a motor, and its a fair bit smaller than the one you mentioned shotglass-hope its alright.

One thing I'm wondering, being new to flaps,is whats the best way to operate them? If it was pure glider I would think it would be throttle, but this already needs the throttle, so......... It would be nice to have camber rather than just on/off
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby Sid Sideslip » Tue Aug 09, 2011 5:30 am

disco stu wrote:My phoenix arrived yesterday. I've already ordered a motor, and its a fair bit smaller than the one you mentioned shotglass-hope its alright.

One thing I'm wondering, being new to flaps,is whats the best way to operate them? If it was pure glider I would think it would be throttle, but this already needs the throttle, so......... It would be nice to have camber rather than just on/off


A lot of the guys on the RcGroups are using the Turnigy T2836-1000Kv motor, it's 300 watts rather than the hefty 550 watts that Sotgglass proposes and weighs in less at 80 grams compared to 115grams. Out of stock atm though. Another dude is using the more powerful NTM3530-1100Kv which is 380 watts nominal. Either would do, as it's probably the temperature of the poorly ventilated mounting, combined with too much throttle for too long that causes problems for some people, rather than lifting a heavy plane aloft. After all, it's only a foam glider.

I'm just looking through the HobbyKing website atm, looking at alternatives. The NTM Prop Drive Series 35-36A 1400Kv / 550W (117grams) that is the equivalent of what shotglass suggests is probably a bit overkill tbh; that's the equivalent of a .30 glow engine at least. Still, it would be a handy motor to have, for all sorts of planes. (says me, so new to electric rc motors :lol: )

As for flaps, that depends on your radio. The Turnigy 9x can mix flaps & ailerons together to create a camber setting using any switch or even the pots, ditto for crow, if you want to try it. With a Dx6i say or another radio with less channels, I'm not sure.
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby Sid Sideslip » Tue Aug 09, 2011 11:32 am

Well, I went with Shotglass' recommended motor, together with a 60amp Turnigy plush esc ( bit pricey for the model, but always handy to have) didn't bother with a separate bec. I also bought a bunch of HXT 900 9g servos with a spare, as I don't trust the stock ones, and some 2400mhr 40c batteries. Given that the rain here isn't likely to clear for at least a week, I should be good to go when it does...probably straight into a tree.

So thanks again Shotty, appreciate the input. :D
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby Shotglass » Tue Aug 09, 2011 11:17 pm

Sid Sideslip wrote:I'll pop in a 3/16" ply ply plate and glass up the area to stiffen it and provide some insulation.


iirc the setup on mine is about 5mm worth of wood epoxied to the inside and a metal plate on the outside to tighten the screws against

disco stu wrote:One thing I'm wondering, being new to flaps,is whats the best way to operate them? If it was pure glider I would think it would be throttle, but this already needs the throttle, so......... It would be nice to have camber rather than just on/off


the usual setup is to have the flaps or rather the brakes on the throttle stick and the motor on a 3 position switch setup up for 0 50% and 100% throttle
ive attached an er9x file to give you an idea of how a basic programming for the phoenix would look like
the channel assignments are a bit nonsensical and are chosen to be compatible to how the mc24 does it
so you have:
1 - motor
2 - aileron 1
3 - elevator
4 - rudder
5 - aileron 2
6 - flap 1
7 - flap 2
channel 11 is for aileron differentiation (most people tend to do this with greater and smaller than 0 mixes on each aileron but then you have to change 2 mixer values to adjust the differentiation whereas with this setup you only need to change the value in channel 11)
and channel 12 is just a fancy way of mixing ailerons onto the flaps

Sid Sideslip wrote:A lot of the guys on the RcGroups are using the Turnigy T2836-1000Kv motor, it's 300 watts rather than the hefty 550 watts that Sotgglass proposes


generally were going by the rule that if it wont climb vertically it doesnt have enough powah
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Re: Dumb question: FrSky telemetry receivers.

Postby disco stu » Wed Aug 10, 2011 12:28 am

I'm pretty sure it was the 2836 1000kv I got also. Thanks for the info guys

One thing I noticed was that mine came with a metal plate infront of the motor on the outside of the firewall, is that the way they all came or is it a newer addition? I had the thought that some aluminium can around the motor might help dissipate some of the heat produced there
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